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Swiss messaging service Threema is being acquired by German investment company Comitis Capital


This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to simsala

Good alternatives to Threema are rare. “Apart from WhatsApp, which dominates the market, there is simply not much room for other messenger services,” notes the digital editor.


What a bunch of marketing bullshit. If at all there is an abundance of good alternatives.

in reply to RunOblomovRun

Good means private. In terms of private there is Threema, Signal, and various self-hosted options that only freaks would actually use.
in reply to jim3692

Not really, since Briar has a very specific usecase and doesn’t have cross platform support
in reply to FoundFootFootage78

Deltachat is really good, decentralized and basically unblockable (unless the government blocks the email protocol... which would break the internet)
in reply to Prunebutt

+1 for delta. it’s a really cool concept and has been working pretty well for me so far, though i’ve not used group chats yet.
for decentralisation/ selfhosting it’s probably the simplest and most battle tested option as it just needs a mail server and nothing fancy
in reply to Prunebutt

Deltachat can't be considered as private as Signal, SimpleX, Briar, Threema or Cwtch due to the fact that it's based on the mail protocol. The mail protocol will always leak metadata (who, to whom, where and when) because it could't function otherwise. And because we live in a world of surveillence, metadata can be oftentimes more valuable than the message itself.

Also saying that deltachat is unblockable because it is based on the mail protocol would be the same as saying that every app utilizing VOIP is unblockable because it uses the TCP/IP stack and blocking it would render the internet unusuable.

in reply to machiavellian

The metadata-issue is addressed in their FAQ

And to the blocking issue:

There are significant benefits to using email as transport in a hostile network environment. As mentioned above, it is infeasible to block email protocols across a network, because everyone relies on email for everything. Since there's no way to differentiate Delta Chat messages from emails on a network, Delta Chat protocols can't be blocked without blocking all email. Individual Delta Chat servers can be blocked, but the protocol cannot be blocked network-wide.


From signal-contingency-plan.info

This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Prunebutt

This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to FoundFootFootage78

Foe many of the federated self hosted ones you can just use the public instances; it's about as freaky as using Lemmy lol
This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to RunOblomovRun

The statement is in regard to the market dominance. You've misread it.
This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Lemmchen

Then it is still not true. Signal has over 11 million users in Germany, Threema has 8-10 million users.
This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to freebee

statista.com/statistics/100517…
in reply to Lemmchen

Yes, I know WhatsApp is biggest overall. But for Threema to say that the competition is WhatsApp and that's it... Is a wrong market analysis imo. In the "privacy conscious" segment signal is the biggest. Threema's biggest competitor in Germany is Signal, not WhatsApp.
in reply to freebee

Depends. Signal is the strongest competitor within that niche, but overall both will only grow if they capture marker share from WhatsApp; which is perfectly feasible as they are in principle perfectly viable substitute products and it's mostly the monopolistic pressures of WhatsApp's preexisting user base. In my personal experiences, Signal, Threema, Matrix, etc. see use within relatively closed bubbles (i.e. I moved my family over to signal, or a work project team uses Element for Matrix, etc.). But more and more people you run into in Germany already have a second messenger that is not owned by Meta in their phone and I would hence expect that WhatsApp's market share will drop over the next few years. Signal imo has the lead here as it works with phone numbers too, so you don't need to know someone else's handle
in reply to RunOblomovRun

The perfect messenger would be open and private.

That means open source, federated with portable account's, e2e encrypted, minimal metadata storage, discoverable contacts, easy to self host as compute, storage and knowledge.

That doesn't exist as of today. Also it's really hard.

Pretty much everything is better than WhatsApp though.

Cursive was added later or modified to clarify.

This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Flipper

Deltachat, Matrix, and Session are federated and E2E encrypted, I think.
in reply to vatlark

At least matrix doesn't let you move your account to other server. Also it doesn't minimize metadata storage. Its is stored on every server for a room.

The other two I don't know. I'll look them.up.

in reply to Flipper

This is the point where you both turn to eachother and say XMPP! at the same time, right?
in reply to Butterphinger

"XMPP is too hard" i hear all the time. i don't get it at all. it's no harder than matrix and it's much lighter to host
in reply to The Quuuuuill

Hell prosody has a module for sending invites.

I'd argue sending someone xxxx@server.fuck and a password is even easier.

Step 1: Download Monal, Snikket or Conversations

Step 2: toss this info in

Step 3: ??? Profit

but how do I send-


use a pastebin

This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Flipper

Yes but those things are being worked on including meta data encryption.

Also, strictly speaking you can migrate accounts, it's just a little cumbersome and needs either some manual effort or separate tooling. I agree though that it should be considerably easier.

This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Flipper

SimpleX doesn't even have an account to move anywhere...
in reply to artyom

My wife and I use SimpleX. I don't know why its not discussed more. Perfect use case for attending protests and such. Get swept up in illegal arrests and they want you to open the app? Enter the self-destruct code. It opens the app normally while destroying any info it contained so they would be none the wiser. It just looks like an empty chat.
in reply to myserverisdown

I dunno about perfect. There's very little available in the way of moderation tools, so it's rife for manipulation. But there's no such thing as perfect and this is the next best thing.
in reply to Flipper

Maybe Matrix with Element.
This entry was edited (3 weeks ago)
in reply to Flipper

Any number of Matrix-based messengers fulfill most of those criteria; meta data reduction could be better but we're getting there.

Also Signal is very decent alternative if you want a WhatsApp-like UX from a trustworthy source.

This reporting seems quite one-sided.

in reply to Ontimp

I know that a lot oft options are close and make different trade offs. But as you said yourself. The fulfill most criteria not all.
in reply to Flipper

No reason to let the perfect be the enemy of the good though. As you said, pretty much anything is better than WhatsApp
in reply to simsala

"Companies" are a fundamentally fucked way to organize the economy.

Anything good a company does can be destroyed almost completely when someone buys them. We need to make structures that are fundamentally, legally resistant to this kinda thing.

in reply to simsala

With Proton, we shouldn't depend on their ecosystem. Diversify the products. Honestly, I think they'll end up shitty like Google.
in reply to simsala

Threema itself emphasize that the arrival of the new investor will not lead to any significant changes


Be honest

for the time being


There you go. For the time being will be about a month or so and then it's time for the enshittification partyyyyy!