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Fedora has been shipping with a broken screen reader for NINE YEARS but the real problem is me

https://ar.al/2024/06/23/fedora-has-been-shipping-with-a-broken-screen-reader-for-nine-years-but-the-real-problem-is-me/

#fedora #accessibility #a11y #ableism #RedHat #IBM #Linux #OpenSource

Fedora has been shipping with a broken screen reader for nine years but the real problem is me

Fedora has an ableism problem but woe to you if you point it out.
Aral Balkan
#opensource #Linux #fedora #accessibility #a11y #IBM #ableism #redhat

Aral Balkan reshared this.

in reply to Aral Balkan

mah:~ $ :arch_linux: 🇪🇬🇵🇸
mah:~ $ :arch_linux: 🇪🇬🇵🇸
• •

desktop Linux users have gotten used to things breaking or being indefinitely broken that nobody notices what actually works and what doesn't. Fedora also has a rep for potentially having the worst most entitled package maintainers, potentially even worse than debian.

Wishing everyone that relies on these tools hard luck to be honest.

in reply to Aral Balkan

Lulu · לולו
Lulu · לולו
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This is awful! I didn't think the linux community would be so disrespectful about accessibility and attack someone personally for giving them valid critical feedback. I'm sorry you had this experience and were left with no accessible option.
in reply to Aral Balkan

NunoF :iterm2_logo: :veritrek:
NunoF :iterm2_logo: :veritrek:
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From someone that hasn't been participating in the flame war, what I found odd is that all Linux distros have been lacking at X, so complaining that linux distro A has been lacking at X raises a flag. Then we can make an effort to align with some political tactic but we are already feeling driven by that flag.
This entry was edited (5 days ago)
in reply to Aral Balkan

DocRekd
DocRekd
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when you are harassing the people working on fixing it instead of directing your 40k followers toward funding those people then yes, you are the problem
https://social.treehouse.systems/@TheEvilSkeleton/112660261861372302

TheEvilSkeleton (@TheEvilSkeleton@treehouse.systems)

@greenWhale@dice.camp if that was the case, individuals from different groups (System76, KDE, elementary, etc.) wouldn't have stood up for us (GNOME) and/or have shared their fair share of experience with Aral: - https://fosstodon.
Treehouse Mastodon
in reply to DocRekd

DocRekd
DocRekd
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for everyone actually interested into improving #a11y on linux please donate (or at least follow) https://fosstodon.org/@accesskit
#a11y
in reply to DocRekd

Aral Balkan
Aral Balkan
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@docRekd Putting aside the insinuation that I’m not actually interested in improving accessibility on Linux, where does one donate? I couldn’t find a donation link there or on the site.
@DocRekd
in reply to Aral Balkan

Malkbethwendy
Malkbethwendy
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Content warning: Tech inaccessibility & chatter

#accesssibility
in reply to Aral Balkan

gunstick
gunstick
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linux can run the most obscure hardware, but then servicing a minority part of the populatiin is not possible?
So pathetic.
I also hate wayland. Just because there is no xdotool and no screensaver.
And their lack of is probably related to having also a broken screen reader.
in reply to gunstick

eshep
eshep
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No proper #xdotool replacement is the part that annoys me most about #wayland. I've heard that #wmctrl is somewhat usable, but even if it worked, it's not really a viabe replacement. There is something called #wlrctl that I've not looked much into yet. My first impression, just from the manpage, does not have me very eager to investigate further.
#wayland #wmctrl #xdotool #wlrctl
in reply to Aral Balkan

WestphalDenn
WestphalDenn
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@Tamasg Wish you all the best and I hope you can get back on your feet after so many attacks for just stating the obvious. As a blind individual myself who trys Linux over and over again just to cave and use something where I can actually get work done I respect you a ton to raise awareness of the technical problems as well as the ableist ones. Thank you and be save
@Tamas G
in reply to WestphalDenn

Aral Balkan
Aral Balkan
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@WestphalDenn @Tamasg Sending you lots of love and here’s hoping some folks do some reflecting and things really do change at a systemic/cultural level.

💕

@WestphalDenn @Tamas G
in reply to Aral Balkan

Steven Rosenberg
Steven Rosenberg
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Thanks for the post. In all the brouhaha, I didn't know a fix was planned for F41.

What I learned from your advocacy is that GNOME is responsible for Orca.

It's there a way that interested people can donate to and help Orca development?

in reply to Steven Rosenberg

Petit Suisse
Petit Suisse
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@steven
Even though the response was awful, we should not ashame fedora team.

I would be curious to see if there's any interaction between #orca and #nvda .
Fortunately, they exist on #fediverse .

Hello @NVAccess

#fediverse #orca #nvda @NV Access @Steven Rosenberg
in reply to Petit Suisse

NV Access
NV Access
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@petit_suisse @steven We don't have a formal partnership or anything, but we are certainly happy to work together for user's benefit - just recently I was speaking with a Libre Office developer around functionality they were hoping to implement such that it would work with both NVDA on Windows and Orca on Linux - things like that benefit eveyrone.
@Steven Rosenberg @Petit Suisse
in reply to Aral Balkan

lukos
lukos
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Jesus. I really want this transition of everyday computer use to Linux pretty smoothly. It is great that you express your feelings, we need room for that. :blobcat_flowercrown: :ablobcatheartsqueeze:
in reply to Aral Balkan

rustynail
rustynail
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just realized US and Russia have the same great red, white and blue
in reply to Aral Balkan

Marcin Juszkiewicz
Marcin Juszkiewicz
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yes. The problem is you. And the problem is in Wayland and rest of stack.

Bitching the project does not help. Look are there solutions, do someone is working on screen reader for Wayland environment.

Help them with testing as it looks like you know how it should work.

in reply to Marcin Juszkiewicz

Marcin Juszkiewicz
Marcin Juszkiewicz
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It helps to look from project perspective sometimes.

When all you get is complaints then (as a developer) you may consider abandoning the project and work on something else.

Or when you have some work in progress but whole feedback is "it sucks".

Be constructive. Help rather just be an asshole.

in reply to Marcin Juszkiewicz

Aral Balkan
Aral Balkan
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@hrw How about you help instead of calling people who are helping assholes?
@Marcin Juszkiewicz
in reply to Aral Balkan

webhat
webhat
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I found the attacks on you for being white the most heinous, from people who call themselves mutuals and have obviously not watched any of your talks or read your posts here or in the other place

As if being white would invalidate anything you are saying

https://infosec.exchange/@webhat/112661270129477842

webhat (@webhat@infosec.exchange)

@november@veganism.social @brainblasted@crab.garden you know he's not white with white privilege, right? He's Middle Eastern, and deals will many of the same bullshit that other middle eastern people in Europe deal with.
Infosec Exchange
in reply to Aral Balkan

Martina Neumayer
Martina Neumayer
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1/n Yes, that's a big problem not only on the Linux platform but also on the mobile as well. My eyes are ok, but my husband eyes are oversensitive to light and bright backgrounds, interfaces, etc. In addition, I have worked in medicine with blind and visually impaired people for many years and hence I know the importance of this whole situation. Those people are literally pushed into the social margins. Often also discriminated in many life situations where they absolutely shouldn't be.
in reply to Aral Balkan

Martina Neumayer
Martina Neumayer
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2/n For example.. Toots, posts full of emojis are very problematic for screen readers apps. Many of them are unable to process such text, some even breaks, hangs or force close as well on that. Second one are bank apps, where lots of banks are blocking any option to read the screen. No screenshoting available, no use of screen readers etc. Not mentioning about such simple thing like implementation of the dark/high contrast mode and/or zooming text, menus etc. of the UI. There's nothing.
in reply to Aral Balkan

Martina Neumayer
Martina Neumayer
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3/n And what should such people do? How they can use average, simple things and tasks of normal life? Where in many countries living without any barriers is an constitutionally written privilege for anyone, not only impaired people. And especially for such people. In those countries doing against, contrary is even considered as a violation of actual law. For example In Germany people have since many years laws called "AGG" - The General Act on Equal Treatment.

https://www.antidiskriminierungsstelle.de/EN/about-discrimination/order-and-law/general-equal-treatment-act/general-equal-treatment-act-node.html

in reply to Aral Balkan

Martina Neumayer
Martina Neumayer
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4/n Those laws are like a book of rules what is allowed, what's not, how some things must be done, how they can't be made etc. If a company, institution, or any private person breaks them, can be sued, punished and such. Very easily and without any exceptions. Punishment are sometimes pretty heavy and expensive as well. That's why people there doesn't break those laws and rules no matter what. If an developer is doing something he is obligated to do that together with those rules and laws.
in reply to Aral Balkan

Eli the Bearded
Eli the Bearded
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My take on patches welcome would be a patch that removes Wayland, but your response is valid, too.
in reply to Aral Balkan

🌱 Shaun✌️✨💖
🌱 Shaun✌️✨💖
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Thank you for speaking up about this issue and thank you for all that you do. Also, sorry you're going through this. ✌️🫶
in reply to Aral Balkan

Javielico 🌖
Javielico 🌖
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wow, just reading the thread, I don't know why but I'm not surprised. Solidarity Aral!
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